The following is the comment we received from Movement Invites Movement, and our comment in reply. We feel it is necessary at this time to clarify exactly the intent of our comment to Miss Tango and our post.
Friday, September 12, 2008
5 comments:
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tangocherie said...
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Hi Irene and Man Yung,
My comment at the moment is addressed to Movement Invites Movement, who not only disallows comments but has a private blog by invitation only, for like-minded friends perhaps. I have no idea as I've never been invited to read their blog.
They don't want to put themselves out there for comments and criticism. They, I imagine, do this to protect their point of view, which is fine.
But people who choose to speak their minds freely in public on their own blogs certainly have the right to do so. And when they publish readers' comments pro and con, they are to be applauded--even when we disagree with a particular post.
As Ruben likes to say, no one person owns the truth. And thank God for that.
I don't like Anonymous comments any more than you do, but I also publish them on my blog. What else can we do? If we don't publish anonymous comments then we are censoring. Should Miss Tango not have published the anonymous comment?
But to Irene and Man Yung, I don't think it can be assumed that the commentators to Miss Tango have never been personally offended by Janis or that they are "jumping on the bandwagon." Do you know for sure that these people have never received nasty personal letters from Janis, as I have, for instance? People who live in Buenos Aires know a little more about her than is obvious from her own writings on the internet.
And I can assure everyone that Janis is simply ecstatic with all of the fuss. -
September 12, 2008 at 5:14 PM
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Irene and Man Yung said...
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Dear Cherie,
Thanks for your perspective regarding this subject, and the words of wisdom from Ruben.
We have no problem about Miss Tango, yourself or anyone out there in cybertangoland publishing an anonymous comment. Our issue was with anonymity and not the decision to publish.
As you know, we have been following your blog for a long time now, and we sympathized with your distress as set out in your post of June 14, 2008. In you post you set out clearly the scenario of the private and personal letter to yourself and Ruben, the reasons for your distress, and your response to it. We're sure that all your readers, like ourselves, appreciated your openness and candor regarding the situation.
However, we have been followers of both Miss Tango and NYC Pilgrim's blogs too (we cannot comment on Anonymous's perspective - that's the problem with Anonymity - and our comments regarding NYC is based only up to the time he went underground due to his inability to handle the vigorous criticisms vis a vis his unpopular viewpoints) and we have no recollection of them dealing with the same, or similar situation as yourself. Both Miss Tango and NYC are outspoken blog writers, and meticulous detailers of their tango experiences, we're sure that if such occurred, cybertangoland would hear about it. It was from this understanding that we felt that insinuations about "tango bullshit" and the like was uncalled for.
Thank you for sharing your opinion, and until the next tango,
Irene and Man Yung -
September 15, 2008 at 9:04 AM
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miss tango said...
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Irene, please do not speak for me. You may think I meticulously detail everything on my blog, but I do not write about all the tango chamuyo that I have heard and observed.
I have no idea what you are making a fuss about. I love the word chamuyo, I love using lufardo, I love the fact that Janis uses Chamuyo Tango, it is the most perfect title I have ever seen in the blog hemisphere.
I am sure if Janis is upset about me loving her blog title, she would have written about her distress to me by now. -
September 16, 2008 at 9:24 AM
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n a n c y said...
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I am bored with this thread but wanted to advise you, Irene, that not all folks who have had unpleasant experiences with Janis have blogs or would wish to discuss those unpleasant experiences with the world. Many of us have known her for many years and we have also heard the other side of the story from the milongueros she purports to represent. And we also have our own experiences and a better mastery of castellano which conflict with her dogma.
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September 16, 2008 at 12:34 PM
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NYC Tango Pilgrim said...
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"our comments regarding NYC is based only up to the time he went underground due to his inability to handle the vigorous criticisms vis a vis his unpopular viewpoints"
Where did you get this idea that my blog went private (not underground ) was because of the above reason? Or was it your own speculation?
Who are you to say my viewpoints were unpopular? Have you met all these women who have told me in person that they've missed my blog and how much they loved reading it? -
September 17, 2008 at 6:27 PM
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You have articulated perfectly one of the many reasons why we don't have open comments. Could you imagine the "Blog Swarming" that would occur (and has basically occurred on another blog which referred to ours)?!
We agree with you that the post was a very sneaky attack on Janis. At the very least, it was poking fun at her in a typically "high school" fashion.
September 12, 2008 10:44 AM
Movements:
Although we appreciate your support of Janis, you misunderstand the intent of our post. It's one thing to point out when there's "Blog Swarming" at work - and quite another thing not to allow any commentary at all. Pointing out "Blog Swarming" when it occurs is part of fair commentary. People can agree, or disagree with us, just as they wish.
Not allowing commentary at all is censorship. We are opposed to censorship. We are not afraid for people to comment, positively or negatively, or even with the intent of "Blog Swarming", on our views. An opposing opinion may turn out to be quite right, or quite wrong - but total censorship is definitely WRONG.
Regarding the intent of our comment to Miss Tango, the first point we wanted to make is about people jumping on the bandwagon to personally attack a specific target - and not because they had been personally offended by the said target, or have some personal issues regarding the said target, but only because it appears trendy to do so to become part of the "in group" which is engaging in this. This kind of aggression really is totally unnecessary, and reveals a part of the "bullying" aspect of human nature. We've observed that it has been going on for a while now, and we felt compelled to point it out.
The other point we wanted to make is regarding anonymous attacks or attacks by pseudonym. This is something we find absolutely reprehensible. Hiding behind anonymity or a facade is the resort of cowards. We wouldn't say anything here on this blog that we wouldn't say to someone face-to-face.
In light of this, we would ask you to consider opening up your blog to comments, and to write your posts using your real identities. Most people in Toronto already know you but we think it is only fair that your worldwide readership has a chance to get know who (the real) you are as well.
These were the crucial points in our comment on Miss Tango's post.
Irene and Man Yung
September 12, 2008 12:53 PM